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Nick: Menelwyn (Registered User)
Date/Time: Sat, 10/16/2004 at 12:16 EDT (Sat, 10/16/2004 at 10:16 CST)
Browser/OS: AOL Browser V9.0 using Windows NT 5.1
In Reply To: Quick thoughts  <erather>  [10/15/2004 @ 22:27]  (1/1)
Subject:
on attitude of Elves to Edain
Message:

"Cute furry creatures"?  Are the Elves thinking of Men like hobbits, then?  No, seriously, I do take your point, and since my theories this week seem to go way to the other extreme, I wanted to comment on it.  And this will also allow me to address that issue of Men being the vassals of Elves, and never vice versa. 

To some extent, you're probably right that at this early stage, the Elves may mainly be thinking of Men as people who will be useful in their immediate war.  The degree to which this is true depends on which specific Elves you're talking about.  The Sons of Feanor, for instance, almost certainly would see Men as little more than tools, if not less (consider the attitude of the C's toward Beren). 

And yet, I cannot help but think that most of the Noldor, who lived in Valinor and learned from the Valar, might recognize that there is ultimately something more to Men than that.  It is not yet time for Men to take on their full role in Eru's plan.  By comparison with the Elves, Men are still children in Arda.  As we often see in children all the potential for what they may be in the future, we know that for now, they need to be guided, trained, apprenticed.  The Valar saw much of the same thing in the Elves; Penthe really hit on something important earlier this week in the observation that Finrod takes an Orome-like role to the Men he meets.  There is hope for the future in Men, there is joy in the coming of these new Children of Iluvatar, but there is also practicality.  For now, perhaps, it is best for the Elves to see Men as allies who may someday become something far more.

And this does touch on the vassal question.  The Elves are the more highly skilled people, the ones with the knowledge of the conditions in Beleriand, and to be blunt the more civilized and cultured people.  How could they become vassals of what are for now lesser people?  And that issue all aside, there is a sort of political point involved as well.  It is the Elves who control the lands that the Men are trying to move into.  They are already the rulers.  It is only proper that the Men seek to serve the Elves in exchange for being granted land in their realms.

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