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Nick: 2ndcreator (Registered User)
Date/Time: Thu, 6/17/2004 at 21:46 EDT
Browser/OS: Microsoft Internet Explorer V6.0 using Windows NT 5.1
In Reply To: Noble oaths and consequences  <Arwen's daughter>  [6/16/2004 @ 22:23]  (1/2)
Subject:
Thanks so much
Message:

Thanks so much for the source, always a great help.  I don't disagree that oaths taken for the right reason show strength of character, what I feel Tolkien worries about is what evil lengths one might have to take in order to fulfill the oath they have taken, not foreseeing the events that come.  To leave the Valar, Feanor had to slay his kin, and later and his quest to regain the Silmarils lead to even more death and destruction of innocents.  Yes, it is important to keep your oath once its made, and perhaps mortals, who have weak bodies and minds, should not expect that they will be able to keep their oaths (for example, in Matthew 5, it says, "do not swear at all: neither by heaven, for it is God's throne; nor by the earth, for it is His footstool; nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King.  Nor shall you swear by your head, because you cannot make on hair white or black.  But let your 'Yes' be 'yes,' and your 'no,' 'no'.  For whatever is more than these is from the evil one.  Unfortunately, when I was making my initial arguments, I was dealing with a different biblical passage (James 5), not knowing Jesus himself said these words.  Hear it is even more clear than James 5, though.  It says 'do what you say you will do,' but warns against swearing by elements, or powers, or objects.  An interesting twist.  I think, and other critics agree, that despite the noble warriors who swear their oaths to their countries, the wise in Tolkien's works warn against swearing oaths.  I am still working out why, how, and how that might relate to the two Bible passages I mentioned, I am still wondering if it swearing by something that is wrong, but saying "I vow to serve my country", is just like letting your 'yes' be 'yes'.  I think it is the actual "I swear BY the ring" (in Gollum's case), which is what is unwise.  Merry, Pippin, Finrod, Sam (who does not vow, but simply says he will go with Frodo), all say what they will do and do it.  Pippin even takes a legal vow to do so (however, if he was not released from this vow, even though his intentions were noble, he would have aided an abbetted the killing of Faramir, an obviously evil thing).  Their vows were made out of love, but did not call down the powers of things they did not control to seal their oaths.  Gollum foolishly swears on something immensely more powerful than himself, and it purposefully kills him.  Feanor swore, "Calling on the Everlasting Dark upon them if they kept it not" (89), once again swearing on something that would end up controlling him.  Even a 'good' character could run the potential of their oath turning evil in the end, and this is where I think the danger lies in Tolkien.  Men who break oaths, they get their just reward, or a certain measure of grace if the judge is merciful (ie Aragorn forgives the palace guard who saves Faramir's life, but still holds him accountable to his vow of service.  Oath breaking I do not worry about, I worry about the danger of oath making (and having the thing you swear on turning your oath to an evil thing).  Hope it helps, and if you have any other suggestions, fire away.

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