IGN.com TheOneRing.net Newbie Guide
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Lord of the Rings - J.R.R. Tolkien

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Links
Home
The Movies
Spy Reports
Features
Barlimans
Discussion
Main
Reading Room
Movie Discussion
The Arena
Gaming
Feedback
Fan Section
Gaming Havens
Green Books
Community
Shop
Newbie Guide
Archives
Site Info
TBHL

<<< - << Prev | Reading Room | Next >> - >>>
Message Thread - Collate Replies - Post a Reply - FAQ

Nick: Acathalion (Registered User)
Date/Time: Sat, 11/1/2003 at 9:13 EDT
Browser/OS: Netscape Navigator V5.0 Custom using KHTML, like Gecko
In Reply To: The Tuff Stuff  <Duffhackymaster>  [10/31/2003 @ 23:54]  (5/15)
Subject:
Adding a tidbit to the enigma
Message:

"... for here dwelt the primeval spirit Moru [Ungoliant] whom even the Valar know not whence or when she came, and the folk of the Earth have given her many names.  Mayhap she was bred of mists and darkness on the confines of the Shadowy Seas, in that utter dark that came between the overthrow of the Lamps and the kindling of the Trees, but more like she has always been; ...."

The possibility that "she has always been" recalls Tom.  This differs from the origin other non-Maia nature spirits who existed at this time:

"These were fays (C); no one knows whence they came: they are not of the Valar nor of Melko, but it is thought that they came from the outer void and primeval dark when the world was first fashioned."

And the fact that even the Valar did not know her origin raises the likelihood that she was not of that order; but even this is uncertain, since in another of the Lost Tales, the Valar do not recognize the children of "Aluin, of Time, who is the oldest of the Ainur", and thus probably Ainur themselves, possibly born after the entry of the Valar into Ea.

The difference suggests that some other class of spirit existed (though still possibly "nature spirits" in a generic sense), not originating in the void and predating creation; if so, the phrase "she had always been" could be interpreted as her coming into being along with Ea.

Of course, I have no idea if this concept had enough breath to survive Tolkien's various baptismal dunkings, and if it was later transferred to Bombadil.

Password to delete message:  



TheOneRing.net Rumour Mill's RPGBoard script (V2.22) was created by Brendan Byrd/SineSwiper of Resonator Software.  It is copylefted under the conditions of the GNU Public License (GPL).  It can be freely distributed and modified as long as it retains its GPL status. 


home | contact us | back to top | site map | search | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 2000 TheOneRing®.net. TheOneRing® is a registered service mark with exclusive right to grant use assigned to The One Ring, Inc. Unique Design by DesignHeroes.com