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Nick: mallorn-ws (Registered User)
Date/Time: Mon, 9/30/2002 at 19:51 EDT
Browser/OS: Microsoft Internet Explorer V5.01 using Windows 98
Subject:
Answers/opinions needed on Frodo's use of the Ring: NZ_Strider: you commented on this once; others also welcome...
Message:

Recently during a Hall of Fire chapter discussion of "The Taming of Smeagol", opinions were presented saying that Frodo NEVER used the Ring on Smeagol. The opinions were that he only threatened to use it--both of the two times (in that chapter and  the following). This has contradicted not only my own understanding but the comments I've heard many times about Frodo using the Ring to dominate Smeagol's will and turn it into helping he and Sam. In my opinion I do not think that during the chapter "The Taming...", the threat alone of using the Ring would've been enough to result in the extent of the change (although temporary) that Smeagol undergoes.  After some 600 hundred years of a certain way of thinking and serving of himself only, I can't see that level of change resulting from even a pretty intense threat. And particularly, could Frodo have exerted such a "threat" himself--one who had not an ounce of desire for power or to dominate another's will--without the use of the Ring? He had never used it before in its intended purpose, so I really wonder if just a threat alone from Frodo could've actually brought the good part of Smeagol's personality to the point of being a challenge to the Gollum part.
Now, I'll admit in the following chapter where Frodo must re-enforce his command to Smeagol, he does say that if, while putting on the Ring, he were to command Smeagol to throw himself off a precipice or into a fire (prophetic here), Smeagol would have to, that this sounds more like a threat, a threat as a reminder since he had already established a certain strength of his will over Smeagol's --with the help of the Ring. So, I'll stand corrected if I'm so off.
I did have another idea: the opposing opinions made me think that perhaps there are degrees of using the Ring to dominate another's will: such as did Sauron have to dominate the will of each Orc or could he do it to a whole race as their "sub-creator"? Also-dominating for a species' life, vs. a few weeks/days? Perhaps that is what Frodo does here: he lightly used the Ring (if possible) on ONE person, Smeagol, the first time and it had a temporary effect.  The second time he threatened to PUT IT ON to use it in a severe way--to severally override one's strongest desire of survival--and this level of use would've been needed to result in this kind of change.
So, with all this and my desperate desire for an answer, I humbly ask as many who are interested to please appease me with guidance and direction, or at least an opinion.

"...and that first hour in which he shone, the white glimmer of a silver dawn..."  "And the bright stars shone as silver fires." "...as a white cloud exceeding swift beneath the moon, as a star...a pale flame on the wings of a storm."

"Red as blood shone their swords."

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